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roadrunner
March 20th, 2015, 09:50 AM
Anyone running an APR flash or have experience with APR?

domino_z
March 20th, 2015, 09:54 AM
aren't you using the dtuk?

roadrunner
March 20th, 2015, 10:01 AM
aren't you using the dtuk?
Always looking at alternatives to see what works best for me. APR offer 7 day trial.

A.U.D.I.
March 20th, 2015, 10:17 AM
Anyone running an APR flash or have experience with APR?
CanberraS3 is running an APR flash - and loves it!

domino_z
March 20th, 2015, 10:36 AM
7 day trial, no brainer

roadrunner
March 20th, 2015, 06:49 PM
7 day trial, no brainer
Goes in on Tuesday :)

ant86
March 20th, 2015, 06:53 PM
Is it getting dynoed? Looking forward to your feedback.

domino_z
March 20th, 2015, 07:21 PM
do it for this guy https://youtu.be/iBp1hoh3vF0

was surprised first dealer visit is 15k

think ill change oil at 5k myself then tune

roadrunner
March 20th, 2015, 08:25 PM
Is it getting dynoed? Looking forward to your feedback.
No dyno facility, but not chasing numbers and APR delivers as advertised unlike others.

roadrunner
March 20th, 2015, 08:27 PM
do it for this guy https://youtu.be/iBp1hoh3vF0

was surprised first dealer visit is 15k

think ill change oil at 5k myself then tune

Changed mine at 500km + filter.

My car won't be going back to Audi Dealership for anything if I can help it...independent for scheduled services all the way and home oil changes in between.

domino_z
March 20th, 2015, 09:03 PM
Spot on

xssiiv
March 20th, 2015, 09:22 PM
No dyno facility, but not chasing numbers and APR delivers as advertised unlike others.

Keen to hear what you think also, very tempting...

schoona
March 20th, 2015, 10:33 PM
No dyno facility, but not chasing numbers and APR delivers as advertised unlike others.

Even to check it's all healthy?

roadrunner
March 20th, 2015, 10:38 PM
Even to check it's all healthy?
APR is very reputable. Installer doesnt have a dyno.

I will arrange a dyno at the next dyno day that my indy workshop has and may use the Torque app or VCDS to do some logs.

Joecool
March 21st, 2015, 12:02 AM
I saw that video a couple weeks ago. Geez, it makes it so tempting. The car in that video pulled like a mofo!

He suggests driving the car for the first few thousand K's like it's stolen to test the turbo, as they are known to fail currently. If all good, then tune!

mp2811
March 21st, 2015, 07:20 AM
I have the APR Tune on my Mk7 R and it's fantastic, massive difference compared to stock! The low/mid torque is sensational! It's still very smooth power and drivability like stock but just way more torque and power everywhere.

I'm guessing most stage 1 tunes similar I just liked the local dealer that I went through. I waited 6 months and did 6000km before tune and would probably advise same to run in car a bit and almost all turbo failures generally been reported in that early time frame.

Looking at dyno numbers you can see on Harding performance facebook dyno of Stock, stage 1 and stage 2 on a Mk7 R. Gains 50kw at wheels across rev range from 3000 rpm and 130nm also. It's a very significant increase.

A.U.D.I.
March 21st, 2015, 07:54 AM
Oh mr ATO ... May my tax return be a good one :arms:

roadrunner
March 22nd, 2015, 06:07 PM
Hoping this will give the S3 the legs to give more in 3rd gear onwards..can't wait :)

xssiiv
March 22nd, 2015, 06:20 PM
Hoping this will give the S3 the legs to give more in 3rd gear onwards..can't wait :)

Looking forward to your review, you may talk me into it lol. I take it the Dtuk tuning box did not satisfy?

What APR dealer will you be using?

homer123456
March 24th, 2015, 09:28 AM
S3 Tune just released on APR website

roadrunner
March 24th, 2015, 12:11 PM
APR Install - First impressions


Drives as stock under low acceleration , but the boost does come on much quicker. The pull is relentless past 30% throttle, and where stock only really hauls in 2nd gear, the APR just carries on in 3rd & 4th. In D the car is more willing to hold the revs rather than the too quick changes in stock form. In S it is an absolute animal and really pushes you back in the seat. Got rear spin briefly when pulling from a stop.

Overall it very smooth and linear.

I had to disconnect the PedalBox as even in the least sensitive setting it was confusing the changes and is just too sensitive/jerky with the higher boost.

domino_z
March 24th, 2015, 12:23 PM
just as i predicted - that you wouldn't need the pedal box to manipulate throttle load vs travel when you actually have more power from a tune

nicely done

any driveability issues like mentioned in that early adopter video?

i can't drive the car in S auto mode, it holds onto gears too long

also, at what km did you start tuning? is 5k the generally accepted turbo safe zone threshold?

roadrunner
March 24th, 2015, 12:54 PM
just as i predicted - that you wouldn't need the pedal box to manipulate throttle load vs travel when you actually have more power from a tune

nicely done

any driveability issues like mentioned in that early adopter video?

i can't drive the car in S auto mode, it holds onto gears too long

also, at what km did you start tuning? is 5k the generally accepted turbo safe zone threshold?

I understand the other early adopter was getting the problem in ECO mode. Can't say I have ever used ECO or Comfort modes.

I will miss the PedalBox for that initial 10% though. Pity there isn't a lighter setting.

Agree that S mode is brutally high revving, but in stock form D mode is lame. The APR vastly improves D, as holds revs a bit higher.

5k!...LOL, mine is on 2k. Asked dealer last week re failed turbos and he said they have had 3 turbos go last year (2 Golf 7R's & 1 hatch S3)...all were early revisions 2014 builds and mileage varied for 500km to 7000km. Nothing since December. His word of caution was driving too hard with low oil temps (<75 deg)

homer123456
March 24th, 2015, 01:36 PM
When's yours booked in Sam?

domino_z
March 24th, 2015, 01:39 PM
nothing booked yet, ill fit exhaust first then go see dean

Fab_R
March 24th, 2015, 04:08 PM
APR Install - First impressions


Drives as stock under low acceleration , but the boost does come on much quicker. The pull is relentless past 30% throttle, and where stock only really hauls in 2nd gear, the APR just carries on in 3rd & 4th. In D the car is more willing to hold the revs rather than the too quick changes in stock form. In S it is an absolute animal and really pushes you back in the seat. Got rear spin briefly when pulling from a stop.

Overall it very smooth and linear.

I had to disconnect the PedalBox as even in the least sensitive setting it was confusing the changes and is just too sensitive/jerky with the higher boost.

Nice work Roadrunner - good summary :)

Did you get the DSG Software also?

roadrunner
March 24th, 2015, 04:21 PM
Nice work Roadrunner - good summary :)

Did you get the DSG Software also?

No DSG APR yet as far as I am aware. Few months away.

Fab_R
March 24th, 2015, 04:25 PM
No DSG APR yet as far as I am aware. Few months away.

I think Guy has the HP DSG Software, but not official as yet for Mk7 / S3 MQB. Correct me if im wrong.

APR will be releasing one shortly i understand.

roadrunner
March 24th, 2015, 06:42 PM
I think Guy has the HP DSG Software, but not official as yet for Mk7 / S3 MQB. Correct me if im wrong.

APR will be releasing one shortly i understand.
Coming from decades of driving manuals, what will a DSG tune give the S3?

fastgun
March 24th, 2015, 06:45 PM
Coming from decades of driving manuals, what will a DSG tune give the S3?


From what I hear, sharper gear changes,longer rev outs, in S mode the Rev Needle bounces on the limiter if you floor it in Manual mode. Reduces clutch slippage due to higher NM due to tune.

AdamD
March 24th, 2015, 07:41 PM
Coming from decades of driving manuals, what will a DSG tune give the S3?

I've driven several cars with the HP DSG tune. It makes D less likely to drop into top gear at the earliest opportunity, and gear selection feels much more natural (to someone like me who's also used to manuals, and more recently the 6-speed DSG). It's also far more responsive to dropping down a gear or two when you apply moderate throttle; essentially, it makes the DSG (and the throttle) much more responsive and useable, without being excessive. S mode is made slightly less manic (depending on the vehicle), so it's more usable on the road, but is still somewhat racey.

The tune isn't just aimed at people who track the car or who tune the ECU; indeed the improvements are most noticeable in daily driving and in traffic.

Everyone I know who's purchased a DSG tune has raved about it, and swears it was worth the (not insubstantial) outlay.

gbernard
March 24th, 2015, 08:09 PM
so i can get the DSG tune without the engine tune ? also will the DSG tune possibly void any warranty if there are gearbox issues in the future ? 3rd question if there is a dealer/factory software update will it remove the tune ?

recruit2
March 24th, 2015, 09:33 PM
I'm tempted to get the Stage1 on my S3 sportback!

The S3 is so super smooth, but I reckon my old Mk6 APR Stage 1 pulled harder at the top end rev range i.e. ran more boost than the stock S3.

The S3 spools quicker though.

roadrunner
March 24th, 2015, 09:46 PM
I'm tempted to get the Stage1 on my S3 sportback!

The S3 is so super smooth, but I reckon my old Mk6 APR Stage 1 pulled harder at the top end rev range i.e. ran more boost than the stock S3.

The S3 spools quicker though.
The boost gauge on the S3 climbs very quickly with the APR S1, far more rapid spooling that stock even on light throttle.

mp2811
March 24th, 2015, 11:35 PM
I had the APR tune for about 2 months before fitting the pedal box. On the first drive with pedal box for first few minutes it was bit sensitive but it settles and does really work together.

I've noticed that gears in D do hang on slightly better after tune also. I have the good comparison of driving My tuned car and wife's stock S3 each day and it does really race through the gears and change super early. Even after tune I think car really needs the DSG tune. That's the only slightly annoying drivablity issue left.

I believe that HP have one available but it's an overnight tune not OBD flash so I would prefer to wait until APR release theirs. I think tune and DSG tune combo would make car perfect, a total animal with great drivability.

AdamD
March 25th, 2015, 10:39 AM
so i can get the DSG tune without the engine tune ? also will the DSG tune possibly void any warranty if there are gearbox issues in the future ? 3rd question if there is a dealer/factory software update will it remove the tune ?

Yes, the DSG tune is entirely separate to the ECU tune. Yes, the same caveats apply to tuning the gearbox as to tuning the ECU (although I'm not aware of whether a tuned DSG can throw a TD1 code in VAS - I'm leaning towards no). Yes, if the dealer updates the DSG software for whatever reason, it would overwrite your tune (in which case it would likely be reinstated by your gearbox tuner for free or a nominal charge).

roadrunner
March 25th, 2015, 03:34 PM
Bit of driving today and the car seems to be settling a bit with the APR and actually seems to be getting stronger. I am persevering with the PedalBox on lowest setting too, but not convinced.

crc
March 25th, 2015, 05:06 PM
Bit of driving today and the car seems to be settling a bit with the APR and actually seems to be getting stronger. I am persevering with the PedalBox on lowest setting too, but not convinced.

The Harding/APR guys can correct me here in turbo-land but that is natural in NA land. Here's something I wrote up re the behaviour of the older Bosch ECU on an S4 in regards to getting the most out of your tune ASAP:

"When you get the tune remember it will take a few 100 kms to adapt. If you want it to adapt straight away try this: go to your nearest 110 zone. Start at 40kmph, using manual mode put it in 5th or 6th, then flatten it and let it struggle to 120-130kph. Do that 3-4 times. Then do the same, except in 3rd, or whichever gear gives you 6,500rpm @ 120kmph. Except start @ 20kmph. (make sure to avoid pressing the kick down switch). Do that 3-4 times. Done. This forces the ECU to advance timing until knock. After 8-10 times total the ECU will remember your fuel quality and hold more advance (I'm talking 6-10 degrees worth!!!). Then it's fun times :smile:"

Basically your ECU is advancing timing and boost until it detects knock then backing off. It takes time for the ECU to gain confidence in fuel quality, atmospheric conditions etc in order to maximise both and therefore power.

recruit2
March 25th, 2015, 07:22 PM
The boost gauge on the S3 climbs very quickly with the APR S1, far more rapid spooling that stock even on light throttle.

Nice one... Does it ever break traction in the dry for you (without using launch mode)?

recruit2
March 25th, 2015, 07:23 PM
Does anyone know if the issue in EFFICIENCY mode still exists? I.e. where the car jolts a bit when the engine re-engages? Or did they solve that?

roadrunner
March 25th, 2015, 07:32 PM
Nice one... Does it ever break traction in the dry for you (without using launch mode)?
Yes. I havent used launch mode, but if you floor it sometimes breaks traction on front or rear with stability in Sport mode. I bet it could get the rear out.... I will take it to the skid pan in a few weeks ;)

recruit2
March 25th, 2015, 09:19 PM
Stop it. You're making me just about to go book in.

Does it do the jerk thing in Efficiency mode that I read some guys were suffering from? Any side effects whatsoever???

A.U.D.I.
March 25th, 2015, 09:28 PM
Any side effects whatsoever???
Yeh; he hasn't been home since...

roadrunner
March 25th, 2015, 09:38 PM
Stop it. You're making me just about to go book in.

Does it do the jerk thing in Efficiency mode that I read some guys were suffering from? Any side effects whatsoever???

Ok, I will try that efficiency mode tomorrow ... never used before, and probably never will again :)

Going to take it for some hard driving in the countryside on Saturday to learn more about the dynamics with the added power.

KAMBO
March 25th, 2015, 10:07 PM
How does one activate launch control? On the jeep you just press the button and does it have a 0-100 timer? The srt does!

roadrunner
March 25th, 2015, 10:12 PM
How does one activate launch control? On the jeep you just press the button and does it have a 0-100 timer? The srt does!
disable stop/start, traction control in sport, transmission in S pr M, hard on brake pedal, full throttle... go

roadrunner
March 26th, 2015, 09:45 AM
Does it do the jerk thing in Efficiency mode that I read some guys were suffering from? Any side effects whatsoever???
FYI, I tried today and I can't replicate the problem in Efficiency mode.

fastgun
March 26th, 2015, 11:29 AM
FYI, I tried today and I can't replicate the problem in Efficiency mode.




DanDanFings is using a BETA APR tune in his car as the UK are still doing R&D. The AU version is final (V1) so I don't think you would have found that issue.

roadrunner
March 26th, 2015, 12:12 PM
DanDanFings is using a BETA APR tune in his car as the UK are still doing R&D. The AU version is final (V1) so I don't think you would have found that issue.
Yes, correct

domino_z
March 26th, 2015, 12:44 PM
first fuel refill this morning

exhaust + intake install on tuesday

might be lowest km apr tune s3 lol

recruit2
March 26th, 2015, 12:49 PM
first fuel refill this morning

exhaust + intake install on tuesday

might be lowest km apr tune s3 lol

Nice one!!!

Also thanks RoadRunner for confirming. That's good to know...

I have made an enquiry re: carbon APR filter and Stage 1 tune. Looks like only takes 45 mins to get the tune done and air intake can arrive within 1-2 days.
I am bloody tempted to just say OK DO IT!!!

roadrunner
March 26th, 2015, 12:58 PM
Nice one!!!

Also thanks RoadRunner for confirming. That's good to know...

I have made an enquiry re: carbon APR filter and Stage 1 tune. Looks like only takes 45 mins to get the tune done and air intake can arrive within 1-2 days.
I am bloody tempted to just say OK DO IT!!!

So the APR tune install is as follows:
- Agent reads your VIN details & gets your contact & email etc. This is sent & registered with to APR.
- Within a few minutes APR sends you an email to accept their terms and limiting liability etc.
- Once you accept, the car can be tuned with the APR software downloaded specific for your VIN.
- Reading OE tune and downloading/installing the APR flash took about 30 mins
- Done!

APR keep a copy of your OE file on their servers, not the agent.

domino_z
March 26th, 2015, 01:00 PM
i bought my apr intake off ebay

met up with him, he never installed it because his tuner recommended the vmr instead

Remarcabull
March 26th, 2015, 01:03 PM
Nice one!!!

Also thanks RoadRunner for confirming. That's good to know...

I have made an enquiry re: carbon APR filter and Stage 1 tune. Looks like only takes 45 mins to get the tune done and air intake can arrive within 1-2 days.
I am bloody tempted to just say OK DO IT!!!

Just do it! you wont regret it! :)

fastgun
March 26th, 2015, 08:46 PM
Just do it! you wont regret it! :)


Famous last words, Haha, just kidding!! Go for it!

Famous last words are like: "Hou vas my dop en check hierdie move"

roadrunner
March 28th, 2015, 08:58 AM
Just back from a hard 5am run up country roads. This APR is better than stock in terms of DSG behaviour and smoothness. I can't stress just how good the smoothness and linear acceleration is.....farkin AWESOME! The DSG seems to have calmed down a bit in 'S' and livened up a bit in 'D'.... I mostly used 'M' though and it is just so damn sweet and keeps on giving and I can control the changes.

I played around with traction control off and it slips on front and rear in 1st & 2nd. Best for me was the half off sport setting which still allows the slip, but allows the electronics to get the grip. I am confident this car could now drift somewhat on a skidpan.

To be honest I was slightly disappointed with the S3 in stock form. It punched in 1st & 2nd, but after that it never really delivered. The APR not only improves the power delivery, but allows the car to punch through 3rd, 4th, 5th... I chickened out in 6th :)

mp2811
March 28th, 2015, 03:52 PM
Just back from a hard 5am run up country roads. This APR is better than stock in terms of DSG behaviour and smoothness. I can't stress just how good the smoothness and linear acceleration is.....farkin AWESOME! The DSG seems to have calmed down a bit in 'S' and livened up a bit in 'D'.... I mostly used 'M' though and it is just so damn sweet and keeps on giving and I can control the changes.

I played around with traction control off and it slips on front and rear in 1st & 2nd. Best for me was the half off sport setting which still allows the slip, but allows the electronics to get the grip. I am confident this car could now drift somewhat on a skidpan.

To be honest I was slightly disappointed with the S3 in stock form. It punched in 1st & 2nd, but after that it never really delivered. The APR not only improves the power delivery, but allows the car to punch through 3rd, 4th, 5th... I chickened out in 6th :)


I couldn't agree more! I've been driving wife's S3 most of week and I definitely think my APR tuned MK7 seems to hold gears better, rev better and is still as smooth as stock. I just can't get over the difference between them. I call the S3 the cruiser as that's how it feels compared to the APR tune.

I find that stock form needs to be pushed fairly hard to feel quick whereas the APR tune just gives effortless power from start. I find I barely need to get above 3500rpm as already hammering at speed limit with tune.

I just can't get over the difference a tune makes.

Remarcabull
March 28th, 2015, 07:32 PM
I'm anticipating my balls in my backside when the stage 3 huge turbo upgrade is released please be 500 hp 😊 then we don't need to worry about the old turbo as a new one is installed 😄

Fab_R
March 28th, 2015, 09:03 PM
Just back from a hard 5am run up country roads. This APR is better than stock in terms of DSG behaviour and smoothness. I can't stress just how good the smoothness and linear acceleration is.....farkin AWESOME! The DSG seems to have calmed down a bit in 'S' and livened up a bit in 'D'.... I mostly used 'M' though and it is just so damn sweet and keeps on giving and I can control the changes.

I played around with traction control off and it slips on front and rear in 1st & 2nd. Best for me was the half off sport setting which still allows the slip, but allows the electronics to get the grip. I am confident this car could now drift somewhat on a skidpan.

To be honest I was slightly disappointed with the S3 in stock form. It punched in 1st & 2nd, but after that it never really delivered. The APR not only improves the power delivery, but allows the car to punch through 3rd, 4th, 5th... I chickened out in 6th :)

Roadrunner...3 words....you are cruel :(

KAMBO
March 29th, 2015, 12:33 PM
how much is the tune?

schoona
March 29th, 2015, 12:46 PM
how much is the tune?

look on the website or call nearest dealer?

mp2811
March 29th, 2015, 02:34 PM
how much is the tune?

I would wait until Easter sale 15% of, should be on now or soon!

recruit2
March 29th, 2015, 03:51 PM
I've been quoted $1695 for the APR tune and it can be done in about 45 mins during a lunch break... Seems pretty good?
Also if you get intake done at the same time, then they won't charge labour for the intake fitment.

KAMBO
March 29th, 2015, 04:09 PM
look on the website or call nearest dealer?

On one hand there is the advertised price, on the other hand there is what people have paid.

just fyi

roadrunner
March 29th, 2015, 04:24 PM
On one hand there is the advertised price, on the other hand there is what people have paid.

just fyi
$1695

April there is 15% off though. Highly recommend European Autotech: Audi Service Sydney | VW Service Sydney | Specialised Audi And VW Mechanics Sydney |Mona Vale (http://www.europeanautotech.com.au/)

Doff
March 29th, 2015, 04:28 PM
how much is the tune?

Around 1600, they have the figure in their website


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BBS3
March 29th, 2015, 05:51 PM
Around 1600, they have the figure in their website


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



So this or Revo i can't pick

Doff
March 29th, 2015, 05:53 PM
So this or Revo i can't pick

Sorry couldn't tell you, i haven't got either but when i do get one it will Be APR. for what it's worth APR seems to be the most popular.

roadrunner
March 29th, 2015, 06:10 PM
So this or Revo i can't pick
It seems that APR put way more R&D into their tunes than Revo...I could be wrong, but my research showed such

mp2811
March 29th, 2015, 06:31 PM
So this or Revo i can't pick

Decision for you to make! I chose APR because much better dealer network local to me! Had number of good chats with Dean at fast stuff and Guy Harding! They put a lot more R&D locally into tune.

Im fairly confident that tune is flash removable in case of warranty issue, I know of one car personally that blew turbo and got replaced and engine repaired under warranty!

I ciuldnt get in touch with local revo dealer and when I did and left message they never called me back.

I think customer service and local dealer more important! I would say pick tune where you have local dealer and support! Both will be great!

gbernard
March 29th, 2015, 06:35 PM
What if any warranty coverage do APR provide ? I looked for alink on the website re this but could not find it.

Doff
March 29th, 2015, 06:41 PM
What if any warranty coverage do APR provide ? I looked for alink on the website re this but could not find it.

Zero warranty on your car, but apparently they can remove the tune if something does arise which doesn't add to the re flash counter so the dealer wouldn't realise it had been tuned.

I think the only things that have gone wrong on these cars where the turbos which where destined to fail but where just accelerated by the tunes. I don't believe anyone has had any other issues?

If you are interested in warranty I believe that ABT offer 2 years on the engine and driveline.

The above is just information I have gathered from forums so just take it with a grain of salt.


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schoona
March 29th, 2015, 07:14 PM
There are standard cars with blown turbos, so tuning is not conclusive evidence of accelerated failure.

The rest I agree with


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mp2811
March 29th, 2015, 08:22 PM
There are standard cars with blown turbos, so tuning is not conclusive evidence of accelerated failure.

The rest I agree with


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There is a poll on MK7 forum I think for GTI turbo and it was 11 failed no tune and 14 with a tune, so tune or no tune can fail. Again most of these on early revision of turbo and in first 5-10K km.

I think with the newer revision turbo's on most of the S3 models now should only be minimal failures.

Doff
March 29th, 2015, 09:16 PM
There is a poll on MK7 forum I think for GTI turbo and it was 11 failed no tune and 14 with a tune, so tune or no tune can fail. Again most of these on early revision of turbo and in first 5-10K km.

I think with the newer revision turbo's on most of the S3 models now should only be minimal failures.

Fo what it's worth the dealer admitted that there was a turbo issue with the older versions but my one (2015) it had all been resolved


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recruit2
March 29th, 2015, 10:15 PM
$1695

April there is 15% off though. Highly recommend European Autotech: Audi Service Sydney | VW Service Sydney | Specialised Audi And VW Mechanics Sydney |Mona Vale (http://www.europeanautotech.com.au/)

Ahh that could get me over the line...! Is the 15% discount offered by ALL APR dealers??

boltor
March 29th, 2015, 10:27 PM
Ahh that could get me over the line...! Is the 15% discount offered by ALL APR dealers??

yep, I believe so. just look at the main APR site, and they will announce the sale soon (I think)

mp2811
March 30th, 2015, 10:15 AM
APR will have sale at all dealers for Easter. Previous years they also have sales in June/July for end of year, XMAS sale and Halloween so generally every 3 months.

I just saw another dyno overnight on UK forum APR tune with R600 intake and it had 372hp and 540nm. The AFR's were pretty good Mid 11's too. If i knew how to upload the images I would (figured it out)

These both MK7R, the Harding Performace is best for showing before and after tune and thicker green line with Exhaust/intake (power at wheels)

mp2811
March 30th, 2015, 10:24 AM
http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=21989&stc=1http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=21990&stc=1http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=21991&stc=1

Sloth
March 30th, 2015, 10:35 AM
This 370HP dyno chart equates to circa 270kw @ the wheels ??? Are they claiming it is only tune and intake to develop this power, or have I missed something here ?

aantss
March 30th, 2015, 10:44 AM
This 370HP dyno chart equates to circa 270kw @ the wheels ??? Are they claiming it is only tune and intake to develop this power, or have I missed something here ?

Correct. The intake isn't even required. Just recommended.

recruit2
March 30th, 2015, 11:22 AM
Very nice...

If the sale pops up in the next few days, then I'm in - I'll go book it immediately.

The intake is expensive for virtually no gains. Ok possible 7hp so what. The intake is mostly just about "noise" appeal, makes it whoosh a bit harder and sound cool?

roadrunner
March 30th, 2015, 11:31 AM
Very nice...

If the sale pops up in the next few days, then I'm in - I'll go book it immediately.

The intake is expensive for virtually no gains. Ok possible 7hp so what. The intake is mostly just about "noise" appeal, makes it whoosh a bit harder and sound cool?

Intakes are a typically waste of time on most forced induction cars...7HP is nothing. It also rings the alarm bells to when opening the hood that the car is probably tuned/modified. Keep it sleeper looking IMO :)

recruit2
March 30th, 2015, 12:04 PM
Intakes are a typically waste of time on most forced induction cars...7HP is nothing. It also rings the alarm bells to when opening the hood that the car is probably tuned/modified. Keep it sleeper looking IMO :)

Yep I'm 100% in agreement there. I don't want Audi or anyone to look at my car and think "Oh this guy has messed with it and therefore it's probably dodgy/flogged/thrashed" etc.

mp2811
March 30th, 2015, 12:09 PM
This 370HP dyno chart equates to circa 270kw @ the wheels ??? Are they claiming it is only tune and intake to develop this power, or have I missed something here ?

I would guess this wasn't at the wheels but at engine. I read car moved a bit on dyno so expected 10-15hp more. That's roughly what I would expect tune/intake would get about 380-390. The intake makes very little difference. I have the VWR r600 intake and with soundaktor off can clearly hear a nice turbo induction sound but that's about it. I like it for the OEM look and the fact that it changes the blocked off entry point to intake on stock and other intakes use, so now how direct flow into intake. Obviously not a huge differnce but definitley wouldn't hurt either.

Remarcabull
March 30th, 2015, 01:10 PM
This 370HP dyno chart equates to circa 270kw @ the wheels ??? Are they claiming it is only tune and intake to develop this power, or have I missed something here ?

Thats at the fly, the S3 / Golf R transmission loss is around 41-45 kw, so around 230kw at all four wheels is around what you would get. im guessing that was a 2WD hub dyno even then those numbers are abit high. Im waiting for stage 3, i want 320kw + at wheels :D

domino_z
March 30th, 2015, 01:26 PM
will the stock turbo even make 300 awkw?

i wouldn't think so, it's pretty small unit

at the least would need to high flow it

you'd also be looking at dodson for a clutch kit north of 250awkw

Remarcabull
March 30th, 2015, 02:04 PM
will the stock turbo even make 300 awkw?

i wouldn't think so, it's pretty small unit

at the least would need to high flow it

you'd also be looking at dodson for a clutch kit north of 250awkw


No way in hell it would make 300kw atw on stock turbo maybe with NO2 / Meth :D

mp2811
March 30th, 2015, 02:11 PM
Thats at the fly, the S3 / Golf R transmission loss is around 41-45 kw, so around 230kw at all four wheels is around what you would get. im guessing that was a 2WD hub dyno even then those numbers are abit high. Im waiting for stage 3, i want 320kw + at wheels :D

I think you're pretty spot on about numbers I would guess about 220-230kw also at wheels. I also like you're thoughts, stage 3 with 300+ would be very nice!!

Aussie Audi Guy
March 30th, 2015, 02:29 PM
I'm back in OZ today, so let me know if you have any questions.

P.S. we never talk wheel KW' as that that can vary 10 - 30% depending on a whole bunch of factors. On the current Golf R's & S3's (8P) stage 3 we see around 260 - 270 AWKW on a Mailine Dyno operated by Mainlines own techs.

aantss
March 30th, 2015, 02:46 PM
I'm back in OZ today, so let me know if you have any questions.

P.S. we never talk wheel KW' as that that can vary 10 - 30% depending on a whole bunch of factors. On the current Golf R's & S3's (8P) stage 3 we see around 260 - 270 AWKW on a Mailine Dyno operated by Mainlines own techs.


Welcome back Guy!

What sort of numbers can we expect with the intake, full turbo back exhaust plus stage 2 tune? Cheers

Aussie Audi Guy
March 30th, 2015, 03:23 PM
Welcome back Guy!

What sort of numbers can we expect with the intake, full turbo back exhaust plus stage 2 tune? Cheers

We have not done our numbers in Australia yet with the new software, (We make more power than the US spec engines), but will report soon as we have a development S3 sedan working on full exhaust / intake & new software when released shortly :)

schoona
March 30th, 2015, 04:16 PM
The awe intake looks the best by miles and is a good price

So the 370hp is 2wd hub dyno mathematically estimating engine power? From which we apply general drive train loss and expect an at the wheels figure ? (Considering we aren't Nelson racing engines and engine dynoing personal vehicles)

Can you test dump pipe only and then full turbo back exhaust guy?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Remarcabull
March 30th, 2015, 04:23 PM
We have not done our numbers in Australia yet with the new software, (We make more power than the US spec engines), but will report soon as we have a development S3 sedan working on full exhaust / intake & new software when released shortly :)


Do we need the APR specced exhaust and sports cat or will it run on a milltek, scorpion, supersprint or ABT?


Might just wait for the full stage 3 package to be released, is it due sometime this year?

recruit2
March 30th, 2015, 04:33 PM
The awe intake looks the best by miles and is a good price

Each to their own I guess. I think the AWE one looks more "factory" kind of looking, it's very nice. But I also love the look of the smooth/curved APR one.

Can anyone confirm how much louder do they make the actual turbo/whooshing noise? Not very?

Remarcabull
March 30th, 2015, 04:37 PM
Each to their own I guess. I think the AWE one looks more "factory" kind of looking, it's very nice. But I also love the look of the smooth/curved APR one.

Can anyone confirm how much louder do they make the actual turbo/whooshing noise? Not very?

decent increase but not drastic, I can show you want you need to modify on your front air intake bar to get the exact same noise if you want and close same performance. If you want more then you need to change the stock filter to a K&N etc

CanberraS3
March 30th, 2015, 04:38 PM
Guy my car is already APR stage 1, so is the tune that comes with the turbo back Milltek exhaust just to stop the fault that will show up?

domino_z
March 30th, 2015, 04:50 PM
re intake, i just feel there's some logic behind the shape of the apr intake creating even flow across the whole filter

rather than these other 'cones in a box' intakes getting hit with air in a concentrated spot - check the filter after a few thousand kms and you'll see and small dirt patch and rest of the intake will be clean lol

recruit2
March 30th, 2015, 08:46 PM
Yep I agree domino. It looks cool/functional. I couldn't pay $600 for a fancy looking carbon fibre square box with a cone filter in it.

recruit2
March 30th, 2015, 08:48 PM
Hanging out to see if APR announce their April sale. I asked the dealer today and they said "Not sure, they only get notified 24 hours before the sale."

Fingers crossed we hear something by Wed. I'll be booking the tune in straight away if so!

roadrunner
March 30th, 2015, 09:42 PM
Hanging out to see if APR announce their April sale. I asked the dealer today and they said "Not sure, they only get notified 24 hours before the sale."

Fingers crossed we hear something by Wed. I'll be booking the tune in straight away if so!

I was too impatient to wait... well worth it :)

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 08:36 AM
Another APR S1 in the UK

APR Stage 1 - S3 | Page 3 | Audi-Sport.net (http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/apr-stage-1-s3.238938/page-3)


http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=22044&stc=1

Remarcabull
March 31st, 2015, 08:52 AM
Another APR S1 in the UK

you able to add the image? i can see the attachment but it wont scale bigger :(

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 08:56 AM
Not sure why, but can see here: http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/apr-stage-1-s3.238938/page-3#post-2422022

Aussie Audi Guy
March 31st, 2015, 09:37 AM
Another APR S1 in the UK

APR Stage 1 - S3 | Page 3 | Audi-Sport.net (http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/apr-stage-1-s3.238938/page-3)


http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=22044&stc=1

Nice to see that air fuel ratio change like that :)

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 09:39 AM
Nice to see that air fuel ratio change like that :)
Yeah, great to see. Haven't seen any other tuners show that. Interested to see ABT's curves on AFR's

Remarcabull
March 31st, 2015, 10:53 AM
Yeah, great to see. Haven't seen any other tuners show that. Interested to see ABT's curves on AFR's

Mid next month i think you will see those, but maybe not from me, tempted just to go flash mine seeing as my turbo should be fine now that we know what causes it :) stage2 numbers on mine would be interesting :D is there a different flash for that?

Aussie Audi Guy
March 31st, 2015, 10:57 AM
There is totally separate software for stage 2 specific hardware.

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 10:58 AM
Mid next month i think you will see those, but maybe not from me, tempted just to go flash mine seeing as my turbo should be fine now that we know what causes it :) stage2 numbers on mine would be interesting :D is there a different flash for that?
No stage 2 yet for APR in Oz, only 3 flashes for RON's 95, 98, 108. I was told to select the 98 only.

CanberraS3
March 31st, 2015, 11:16 AM
There is totally separate software for stage 2 specific hardware.


When are they releasing the stage 2 APR tune, also is the stage 2 tune stage 1 plus a turbo back exhaust?

Is the current tune file for the Milltek turbo back exhaust just to get rid of the cel error that will show up?

Remarcabull
March 31st, 2015, 11:39 AM
There is totally separate software for stage 2 specific hardware.

What does that require? is the following enough to have that done?

I have Intake, Intercooler, Sports Cat and sports exhaust.

And whats the output change to?

aantss
March 31st, 2015, 11:53 AM
What does that require? is the following enough to have that done?

I have Intake, Intercooler, Sports Cat and sports exhaust.

And whats the output change to?



http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by aantss http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/a3-s3-rs3/47010-apr-flash-tune-post403584.html#post403584)
Welcome back Guy!

What sort of numbers can we expect with the intake, full turbo back exhaust plus stage 2 tune? Cheers



We have not done our numbers in Australia yet with the new software, (We make more power than the US spec engines), but will report soon as we have a development S3 sedan working on full exhaust / intake & new software when released shortly :smile:

Remarcabull
March 31st, 2015, 12:24 PM
http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by aantss http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/a3-s3-rs3/47010-apr-flash-tune-post403584.html#post403584)
Welcome back Guy!

What sort of numbers can we expect with the intake, full turbo back exhaust plus stage 2 tune? Cheers



We have not done our numbers in Australia yet with the new software, (We make more power than the US spec engines), but will report soon as we have a development S3 sedan working on full exhaust / intake & new software when released shortly :smile:


So a normal stage 1 tune will work for the time being until stage 2 is released? or are both available? sorry little confused.

aantss
March 31st, 2015, 12:36 PM
So a normal stage 1 tune will work for the time being until stage 2 is released? or are both available? sorry little confused.

Stage 1 will work for now. Stage 2 has not yet been released :)

recruit2
March 31st, 2015, 12:38 PM
Anyone heard of the APR sale happening? If so I'm going straight in to get my car flashed...

aantss
March 31st, 2015, 12:41 PM
Anyone heard of the APR sale happening? If so I'm going straight in to get my car flashed...


Keep an eye on the website. They post up there.

mp2811
March 31st, 2015, 01:11 PM
Anyone heard of the APR sale happening? If so I'm going straight in to get my car flashed...

It's an exciting time for you! I was on waiting list for notification as soon as it was released for the MK7R! Kept ringing up Guy Harding and Dean Coutts and getting updates as the tune came along. Both very informative and helpthrough throughout!

Aussie Audi Guy
March 31st, 2015, 02:19 PM
No sale scheduled for Easter, we did negotiate the prices so the software did not increase (as most of the hardware did). With the new APR management, you will see less general sales from APR US, and in Australia.

KAMBO
March 31st, 2015, 02:37 PM
Changed mine at 500km + filter.

My car won't be going back to Audi Dealership for anything if I can help it...independent for scheduled services all the way and home oil changes in between.

who/where?

I'm not sure who I would trust!

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 02:59 PM
who/where?

I'm not sure who I would trust!

I change my own oil & filters, brakes, coolant etc.

A scheduled service once a year can be done by any independent, but EA or Advan Performance are workshops I'd trust. Just need the book stamped really. I only do around 10,000km/year.

I keep receipts for all my interval service work that I do at home as well worth it when you sell the car.

schoona
March 31st, 2015, 04:24 PM
Nice to see that air fuel ratio change like that :)

Nice if apr website has that info based real world chassis dyno plots and measurements ...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

fastgun
March 31st, 2015, 04:39 PM
No sale scheduled for Easter, we did negotiate the prices so the software did not increase (as most of the hardware did). With the new APR management, you will see less general sales from APR US, and in Australia.


Guy, in principle this is disappointing as the Golf R version that was released in Dec 14 was part of the sale, and it was stated that Audi owners would get the benefit as well when the software released. The software was delayed so the sale period expired...Now no sale?

Aussie Audi Guy
March 31st, 2015, 05:12 PM
Guy, in principle this is disappointing as the Golf R version that was released in Dec 14 was part of the sale, and it was stated that Audi owners would get the benefit as well when the software released. The software was delayed so the sale period expired...Now no sale?

All I can say is, the only thing we were given a concession on with the last price rise (March 15th) was the software - so instead of it going up in price, it has remained the same - we could put it up 15% and then give you 15% off but unfortunately a mute point.

This is due to the AUD tanking since the project started work. XE.com - AUD/USD Chart (http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=AUD&to=USD&view=1Y)

You will find that with the new APR Management, they will be changing the style & culture of how "sales" & "promotions" are run, and is out of our hands here in Australia.

fastgun
March 31st, 2015, 05:47 PM
Thanks Guy, always good to know about the effort that goes on behind the scenes 😉

omarko
March 31st, 2015, 06:06 PM
sorry so if I buy this :

APR - High Performance Development for Audi, VW and Porsche Vehicles. (http://goapr.com.au/products/ecu_upgrade_s38v_20t_gen3_au.html)

is it just plug and play and off I go ? or do I have to download another map which has torque limit so it does not blow my transmission apart unless I replace the slipping clutch ? How much is that btw?

recruit2
March 31st, 2015, 07:32 PM
I was also curious about that...

To me it just looks like they're covering their own butt by making that statement, just in case you get the tune and do repeated launches 50 times in a row within 50 minutes until you completely kill the car. Well you could probably cook a stock car by doing that too if you flogged it hard enough.

I don't see the point of buying the tune but getting the "torque limited" version.
I want my stupendous torque that occasionally breaks AWD traction LOL.

recruit2
March 31st, 2015, 07:33 PM
PS I'm trying to book in for tomorrow! Woot.:woah2:

recruit2
March 31st, 2015, 07:40 PM
PS I'm trying to book in for tomorrow! Woot.:woah2:

Ok it's locked in, wish me luck...!!! :)

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 07:47 PM
I was also curious about that...

To me it just looks like they're covering their own butt by making that statement, just in case you get the tune and do repeated launches 50 times in a row within 50 minutes until you completely kill the car. Well you could probably cook a stock car by doing that too if you flogged it hard enough.

I don't see the point of buying the tune but getting the "torque limited" version.
I want my stupendous torque that occasionally breaks AWD traction LOL.

Yes, they will install the 98RON version. You have to accept a waiver/disclaimer via email before the install can begin.

Enjoy... just in-time for double demerits weekend, so be careful !

recruit2
March 31st, 2015, 07:52 PM
Yes, they will install the 98RON version. You have to accept a waiver/disclaimer via email before the install can begin.

Enjoy... just in-time for double demerits weekend, so be careful !

Good point...

I mean ultimately it's just a boost increase, done professionally by an experienced company and being done on a car that has very tough factory hardware that can cope with it anyway.

I had ZERO issues on my Golf R Stage 1 tune. I'm excited!!!

schoona
March 31st, 2015, 08:11 PM
It can't be just a boost increase, it doesn't take 6 months and 12 engineers to achieve the boost increase.

Think about the mk5/6 golds and roccos getting custom tunes.

There is a fair bit of 'justfication' going on.

I love my missus car tuned (apr) but looking at what is actually involved...

Domino's r35 is completely individual, way more high tech, requires far more car considering so many hard ware changes and was probably tuned in a day.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Timbo
March 31st, 2015, 08:23 PM
....I mean ultimately it's just a boost increase, done professionally by an experienced company and being done on a car that has very tough factory hardware that can cope with it anyway.

Not by the AFR charts published, or the fact that tunes are offered for different fuels. That clearly indicates a lot of effort has been given to boost, fueling and ignition.

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 08:29 PM
Good point...

I mean ultimately it's just a boost increase, done professionally by an experienced company and being done on a car that has very tough factory hardware that can cope with it anyway.

I had ZERO issues on my Golf R Stage 1 tune. I'm excited!!!

Not just boost. The APR is completely new software around fuel, timing, boost, lambdas, wastegate operation, load etc. APR is comprehensive and basically completely reworked factory software.

Bain
March 31st, 2015, 09:58 PM
Not just boost. The APR is completely new software around fuel, timing, boost, lambdas, wastegate operation, load etc. APR is comprehensive and basically completely reworked factory software.

Exactly.

Are you planning to dyno the car sometime soon?

dstama
March 31st, 2015, 10:26 PM
Nice to see that air fuel ratio change like that :)

For the uninitiated, in layman's terms, what's the benefit/impact of this?

(and the tune improves this over stock?)

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 10:33 PM
For the uninitiated, in layman's terms, what's the benefit/impact of this?

(and the tune improves this over stock?)

Too lean and you will get detonation and high EGT, bad for both engine and turbo. Explained below (the last sentence spells out why tuning boxes can never be a long-term solution):

Why lean makes more power but is dangerous
When discussing engine tuning the 'Air/Fuel Ratio' (AFR) is one of the main topics. Proper AFR calibration is critical to performance and durability of the engine and it's components. The AFR defines the ratio of the amount of air consumed by the engine compared to the amount of fuel.
A 'Stoichiometric' AFR has the correct amount of air and fuel to produce a chemically complete combustion event. For gasoline engines, the stoichiometric, A/F ratio is 14.7:1, which means 14.7 parts of air to one part of fuel. The stoichiometric AFR depends on fuel type-- for alcohol it is 6.4:1 and 14.5:1 for diesel.
So what is meant by a rich or lean AFR? A lower AFR number contains less air than the 14.7:1 stoichiometric AFR, therefore it is a richer mixture. Conversely, a higher AFR number contains more air and therefore it is a leaner mixture.
For Example:
15.0:1 = Lean
14.7:1 = Stoichiometric
13.0:1 = Rich
Leaner AFR results in higher temperatures as the mixture is combusted. Generally, normally-aspirated spark-ignition (SI) gasoline engines produce maximum power just slightly rich of stoichiometric. However, in practice it is kept between 12:1 and 13:1 in order to keep exhaust gas temperatures in check and to account for variances in fuel quality. This is a realistic full-load AFR on a normally-aspirated engine but can be dangerously lean with a highly-boosted engine.
Let's take a closer look. As the air-fuel mixture is ignited by the spark plug, a flame front propagates from the spark plug. The now-burning mixture raises the cylinder pressure and temperature, peaking at some point in the combustion process.
The turbocharger increases the density of the air resulting in a denser mixture. The denser mixture raises the peak cylinder pressure, therefore increasing the probability of knock. As the AFR is leaned out, the temperature of the burning gases increases, which also increases the probability of knock. This is why it is imperative to run richer AFR on a boosted engine at full load. Doing so will reduce the likelihood of knock, and will also keep temperatures under control.

There are actually three ways to reduce the probability of knock at full load on a turbocharged engine: reduce boost, adjust the AFR to richer mixture, and retard ignition timing. These three parameters need to be optimized together to yield the highest reliable power.

roadrunner
March 31st, 2015, 10:42 PM
Exactly.

Are you planning to dyno the car sometime soon?
Just waiting for a dyno day to come along one Saturday at my old tuner's shop. I posted a chart from a dyno done in the UK last week (Here: http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/a3-s3-rs3/47010-apr-flash-tune-6.html#post403731), so doubt mine would show much difference.

Doff
April 1st, 2015, 07:46 AM
Does anyone opt for this

"APR’s standard Stage I ECU Upgrade offers a large increase in low-end torque, which may overpower the factory clutch. While APR did not experience clutch slip at the advertised torque levels and even higher, others may due to clutch health and driving style. APR recommends upgrading slipping clutches, but has also created special software designed to deliver the same peak horsepower with a cap on low end torque to reduce or eliminate slipping. These specific files are available with various torque caps set lower than the standard Stage I ECU Upgrade."

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 08:02 AM
Does anyone opt for this

"APR’s standard Stage I ECU Upgrade offers a large increase in low-end torque, which may overpower the factory clutch. While APR did not experience clutch slip at the advertised torque levels and even higher, others may due to clutch health and driving style. APR recommends upgrading slipping clutches, but has also created special software designed to deliver the same peak horsepower with a cap on low end torque to reduce or eliminate slipping. These specific files are available with various torque caps set lower than the standard Stage I ECU Upgrade."


These power options in the APR S1 are driven by the 3 RON fuel grade options. I inquired about the 95RON option to reduce the output and it wasn't recommended, but rather stick to 98RON software. If you are sensible with your transmission it should be fine, but no doubt it will reduce the clutch life somewhat and can then be replaced with an upgraded clutch. I will opt for the DSG tune when it becomes available.

Doff
April 1st, 2015, 08:11 AM
These power options in the APR S1 are driven by the 3 RON fuel grade options. I inquired about the 95RON option to reduce the output and it wasn't recommended, but rather stick to 98RON software. If you are sensible with your transmission it should be fine, but no doubt it will reduce the clutch life somewhat and can then be replaced with an upgraded clutch. I will opt for the DSG tune when it becomes available.


Thank you, that clears things up.

Aussie Audi Guy
April 1st, 2015, 09:40 AM
There is a lower power option (reduces output by 7kw & 25nm) - mainly for those people in AWD cars with manual transmissions who try to launch, or the FWD versions (not seen in Australia) to aid traction.

We have it available, but coming up on a hundred cars done, no one has requested it.

Aussie Audi Guy
April 1st, 2015, 09:41 AM
P.S. The transmissions are mechanically identical to the previous generation, so the stock DSG will easily handle a lot more power & torque than we are currently offering :)

omarko
April 1st, 2015, 09:52 AM
who can do this tune in Sydney ?

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 09:59 AM
who can do this tune in Sydney ?
I used EA in Mona Vale (European Autotech: Audi Service Sydney | VW Service Sydney | Specialised Audi And VW Mechanics Sydney |Mona Vale (http://www.europeanautotech.com.au/)). Very good workshop IMO.

Aussie Audi Guy
April 1st, 2015, 10:04 AM
who can do this tune in Sydney ?

Dealer list:

APR - High Performance Development for Audi, VW and Porsche Vehicles. (http://www.goapr.com.au/dealer/index.html)

11013mb
April 1st, 2015, 10:21 AM
I used EA in Mona Vale (European Autotech: Audi Service Sydney | VW Service Sydney | Specialised Audi And VW Mechanics Sydney |Mona Vale (http://www.europeanautotech.com.au/)). Very good workshop IMO.

I would be using them too if I decide to go ahead with a stage 1 tune and it would definitely be APR

Ive thrown the question around to a few friends on social media, some of which are reacting through statements that fundamentally classifies APR as off she shelf products and that a custom tune should be instead considered. I have argued against that, as evidently APR go through extensive R&D on these tunes before they are released. Plus, the results and feedback here speaks for it self

Some have also argued for Evolve Teknik tunes

RoadRunner: Did you go to the workshop to have the the installed? It seems that these folks can also come out to you and deliver the tune as per Performance upgrades | European Autotech: Audi Service Sydney | VW Service Sydney (http://www.europeanautotech.com.au/services/performance-upgrades-audi-volkswagen-bmw-porsche/)

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 10:43 AM
I would be using them too if I decide to go ahead with a stage 1 tune and it would definitely be APR

Ive thrown the question around to a few friends on social media, some of which are reacting through statements that fundamentally classifies APR as off she shelf products and that a custom tune should be instead considered. I have argued against that, as evidently APR go through extensive R&D on these tunes before they are released. Plus, the results and feedback here speaks for it self

Some have also argued for Evolve Teknik tunes

RoadRunner: Did you go to the workshop to have the the installed? It seems that these folks can also come out to you and deliver the tune as per Performance upgrades | European Autotech: Audi Service Sydney | VW Service Sydney (http://www.europeanautotech.com.au/services/performance-upgrades-audi-volkswagen-bmw-porsche/)

Yes, I went in to their workshop...45min turn around. Ask them if they can do a mobile install.

Custom tune? ...sure if you have a lot of aftermarket hardware and trying to squeeze every last bit of power. Most custom tunes I know about don't overhaul the entire ECU software, they simply change a few aspects around fuel maps, timing and boost. I.e. they won't change wastegate operation etc. I had a Cobb flash tune in my previous car and a lot of aftermarket hardware. I got a independent Cobb tuner to create custom maps and they did provide 12% more power over the Cobb OTS maps, but they really only fine tuned fueling and timing.

Ask yourself if a custom tuner can achieve in 1-2 hours what it takes companies like APR months to achieve in R&D.

For me there are a few important things to consider in choosing a tune:
- R&D
- Support & dealer network
- Company is established and a renowned tuner
- Install & forget

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 11:06 AM
Ok waiver accepted :)

I'm at the place now - car has gone in...

Guys have told me that the stock DSG is super bloody tough and it'll laugh at the new power.

They're also saying these new tunes are pretty nuts and the torque increase is ridiculous.

And several golf r's have blown turbos but that's equally pre and post tune. If you are unlucky and your turbo blows it was going to blow anyway and they completely revert the tune and you go in and get it replaced under warranty no hassles.

Also start stop is extremely intelligent and only kicks in under a range of different factors including oil temp. If oil temp is too hot the start stop function won't kick in and similarly if battery levels are low then it also won't shut the engine off etc.

Makes a lot of sense, they said the problem has definitely been faulty turbo revisions..

I'm very comfortable with all of the above.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 11:10 AM
Ok waiver accepted :)

I'm at the place now - car has gone in...

Guys have told me that the stock DSG is super bloody tough and it'll laugh at the new power.

They're also saying these new tunes are pretty nuts and the torque increase is ridiculous.

And several golf r's have blown turbos but that's equally pre and post tune. If you are unlucky and your turbo blows it was going to blow anyway and they completely revert the tune and you go in and get it replaced under warranty no hassles.

Also start stop is extremely intelligent and only kicks in under a range of different factors including oil temp. If oil temp is too hot the start stop function won't kick in and similarly if battery levels are low then it also won't shut the engine off etc.

Makes a lot of sense, they said the problem has definitely been faulty turbo revisions..

I'm very comfortable with all of the above.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Enjoy the tune :)...it will take about 50-100km to fully adapt. Help the process with a few WOT pulls

gbernard
April 1st, 2015, 11:12 AM
If you do have an aftermarket tune, and you are unfortunate enough to have the turbo fail, given the car is undriveable how do you go about removing the time before it gets to a dealer for inspection / warranty replacement ?

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 11:19 AM
If you do have an aftermarket tune, and you are unfortunate enough to have the turbo fail, given the car is undriveable how do you go about removing the time before it gets to a dealer for inspection / warranty replacement ?
Tow to tuner, uninstall, call Audi to collect, preferably a block from the tuner ;)

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 11:20 AM
Yep $50 tow to tuner, they reinstall your factory software for free. $50 tow somewhere else then call audi.


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andrewjamesdean
April 1st, 2015, 11:21 AM
You'd need to have it towed to your APR tuner first, have the flash removed, then have it towed to the Audi dealer

homer123456
April 1st, 2015, 11:21 AM
^ Good question. Flat bed?

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 11:22 AM
Audi have issued a Technical Service Bulletin that says particular turbos manufactured between certain dates are prone to failure. They know about it. But they don't replace unless it blows up and also some of the affected models never blow up.


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recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 11:23 AM
"The tune can exacerbate a faulty turbo failing, because it might just push it over the limit"


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recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 11:23 AM
I'd rather find out it was faulty and get another turbo put in rather than worrying about what might happen for the life of the car..


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Remarcabull
April 1st, 2015, 11:28 AM
I'd rather find out it was faulty and get another turbo put in rather than worrying about what might happen for the life of the car..


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Ok I might just buy a spare... Maybe a group buy is in order fab_r lol

11013mb
April 1st, 2015, 11:39 AM
@recruit2

Thanks for that information which is useful. Is this information public? If not, please can you share the specifics of this bulletin

A.U.D.I.
April 1st, 2015, 11:41 AM
@recruit2

Thanks for that information which is useful. Is this information public? If not, please can you share the specifics of this bulletin

Yes please - some concrete doco / reference number would assist

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 12:40 PM
This is all I've got:

Additionally, on August 5, 2014, Audi released a Technical Service Bulletin (21E7 UPDATE) stating that on A3 vehicles manufactured during a certain period “the turbocharger may fail causing the MIL to illuminate.” The turbochargers referenced in this bulletin are the same as or similar to those utilized on other vehicles manufactured by the Volkswagen Auto Group (VAG).




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11013mb
April 1st, 2015, 01:22 PM
Thanks

I found this http://www.goapr.com/support/tsb/21e7.pdf

EDIT: It notes,  Procedure must be performed on applicable vehicles in dealer inventory prior to sale.

This must be an implied condition herewith

I would then tend to assume rather that prior to sale of vehicles, dealers would do their appropriate proactive checks?

HOwever, this still doesnt nullify the propensity for the turbo to fail during use of the vehicle which relates to this particular reason





This is all I've got:

Additionally, on August 5, 2014, Audi released a Technical Service Bulletin (21E7 UPDATE) stating that on A3 vehicles manufactured during a certain period “the turbocharger may fail causing the MIL to illuminate.” The turbochargers referenced in this bulletin are the same as or similar to those utilized on other vehicles manufactured by the Volkswagen Auto Group (VAG).




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Remarcabull
April 1st, 2015, 01:48 PM
Thanks

I found this http://www.goapr.com/support/tsb/21e7.pdf

EDIT: It notes,  Procedure must be performed on applicable vehicles in dealer inventory prior to sale.

This must be an implied condition herewith

I would then tend to assume rather that prior to sale of vehicles, dealers would do their appropriate proactive checks?

HOwever, this still doesnt nullify the propensity for the turbo to fail during use of the vehicle which relates to this particular reason


Note this line.... wonder what keeps oil going while engine has stopped at traffic lights and its blazing hot from the epic run you just had.

After install the turbocharger, let the engine idle for approximately 1 minute without increasing engine speed. Thisensures adequate oil supply to the turbocharger

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 02:31 PM
The guys today told me that if the oil is too hot the stop start won't be allowed to kick in ...


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recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 02:36 PM
Hey anyway I'm all done and the car is just amazing to drive.!!! Very very happy with it, feels so smooth and effortless at mid throttle with hardly any effort from your right foot, but absolutely brutal when you give it a real jab.

I apparently have a risk that my turbo may let go at some stage due to the model number which is no good but it hasn't yet. So I'll cross that bridge when I come to it (fingers crossed I won't), but if it does fail at least the end result is a shiny replacement unit.

I would highly recommend the tune. Has transformed the car completely. I smile a lot more now when I drive it!


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sammo
April 1st, 2015, 02:50 PM
I would highly recommend the tune. Has transformed the car completely. I smile a lot more now when I drive it!

I had the same experience with my Mk5 and Mk6 GTIs with APR stage 2+ eventually on both. The new engine in the S3 is another level of power again - feeling very tempted to upgrade.

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 02:55 PM
Hey anyway I'm all done and the car is just amazing to drive.!!! Very very happy with it, feels so smooth and effortless at mid throttle with hardly any effort from your right foot, but absolutely brutal when you give it a real jab.

I apparently have a risk that my turbo may let go at some stage due to the model number which is no good but it hasn't yet. So I'll cross that bridge when I come to it (fingers crossed I won't), but if it does fail at least the end result is a shiny replacement unit.

I would highly recommend the tune. Has transformed the car completely. I smile a lot more now when I drive it!


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Haha...it rocks doesn't it? :) What I like most is the way it contiues to haul through all the gears and not just 1st & 2nd like stock....smoother than stock IMO

Remarcabull
April 1st, 2015, 02:58 PM
Hey anyway I'm all done and the car is just amazing to drive.!!! Very very happy with it, feels so smooth and effortless at mid throttle with hardly any effort from your right foot, but absolutely brutal when you give it a real jab.

I apparently have a risk that my turbo may let go at some stage due to the model number which is no good but it hasn't yet. So I'll cross that bridge when I come to it (fingers crossed I won't), but if it does fail at least the end result is a shiny replacement unit.

I would highly recommend the tune. Has transformed the car completely. I smile a lot more now when I drive it!


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Awesome! How many kms have you done and what is your turbo revision?

Quote from Audi:

Part number 06k145722h is the replacement for the turbo in your car, the original one fitted is 06k145702N then it was replaced by 06k145722A then the latest is 06k145722H.

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 03:19 PM
Yep I have the dodgy 702N one, that's her...


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Remarcabull
April 1st, 2015, 03:24 PM
Yep I have the dodgy 702N one, that's her...


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Boost it around for a week and report back how its going :) inspires confidence in the rest of the people with that turbo :) fingers crossed if it does go no sharpnel goes in the wrong direction. not sure which end of the turbo goes, hopefully the intake end has something stopping it from hitting the sides when the exhaust side goes?

I wouldnt say its dodgy i would say people used start stop alot? how do you treat your car? warmup cooldown? startstop?

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 03:30 PM
I have a lot of "mechanical sympathy" for my cars and always very gentle slow warm up and cool down, very frequent oil changes and I honestly don't even drive them hard (often). Just a few boost squirts for fun every now and then, mostly I just punt into work and back pretty gently. Certainly no sustained hard driving whatsoever.


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Remarcabull
April 1st, 2015, 03:39 PM
I have a lot of "mechanical sympathy" for my cars and always very gentle slow warm up and cool down, very frequent oil changes and I honestly don't even drive them hard (often). Just a few boost squirts for fun every now and then, mostly I just punt into work and back pretty gently. Certainly no sustained hard driving whatsoever.


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Awesome, sounds like me, you will also find that dynamic mode brings down the engine coolant temps to 90 degress down from 107 degrees in Auto mode. So idling in Dynamic will cool down your engine and turbo quicker at idle. I check my catalyst temps before turning off, anywhere around 400-450 degress should be safe as i think the cat runs alot hotter than whats going through the turbo? (correct me if im wrong)

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 03:42 PM
Anyone running a P3 vent gauge in their S3?

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 04:07 PM
Cool that's interesting... I love dynamic mode... What it revs the fans or coolant pump harder??


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Remarcabull
April 1st, 2015, 04:17 PM
Cool that's interesting... I love dynamic mode... What it revs the fans or coolant pump harder??


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No, the software requests 90 degrees when you floor it or have it in dynamic mode, proof is in the pudding as i checked when running VCDS, it drops to 90 degrees very quickly! so 90 degress is the perfect performance temperature, and 107 degrees is perfect emissions and efficiency temperature.

roadrunner
April 1st, 2015, 04:21 PM
No, the software requests 90 degrees when you floor it or have it in dynamic mode, proof is in the pudding as i checked when running VCDS, it drops to 90 degrees very quickly! so 90 degress is the perfect performance temperature, and 107 degrees is perfect emissions and efficiency temperature.

I actually notice lower temps since the APR tune. Usually under 95 even when driving hard. Before it was always around 105 regardless of driving style.

Remarcabull
April 1st, 2015, 04:25 PM
I actually notice lower temps since the APR tune. Usually under 95 even when driving hard. Before it was always around 105 regardless of driving style.


Sounds good, keeps things within more respectable temps.

11013mb
April 1st, 2015, 04:59 PM
Mine varies between 105 - 110 and sometimes hovers about 111 / 112

I do like boosting it most of the time though

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 06:53 PM
No, the software requests 90 degrees when you floor it or have it in dynamic mode, proof is in the pudding as i checked when running VCDS, it drops to 90 degrees very quickly! so 90 degress is the perfect performance temperature, and 107 degrees is perfect emissions and efficiency temperature.

Ahhh got it. Very cool...

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 06:56 PM
Some funny things happened today on the way home from work (I picked up my wife who knew I was going in for an "oil change") today.
In 4th gear, I had to get past this other car. Normally it would pull slowly, or I'd go back to third at this speed.
But I just left it in 4th and boosted over into the other lane. So funny she goes "Oh wow I just got shivers". I said what do you mean?
She said you just went fast then. LOL. So subconsciously she was used to how 4th gear was before and this surprised her, with no idea of the tune. I.e. a true placebo test! It happened another time later also but in 2nd gear. Good proof that it is hugely noticeable.

A.U.D.I.
April 1st, 2015, 07:25 PM
Some funny things...
She said you just went fast then. LOL. So subconsciously...with no idea of the tune.
A true magician sir. That is also my plan. 'No idea of the tune' ;)

xssiiv
April 1st, 2015, 07:33 PM
So tempting... [emoji15]

recruit2
April 1st, 2015, 08:02 PM
I just didn't honestly want to go through all the pain and explaining/convincing all over again.
It makes the car better and it improves fuel economy. So you're basically taking it in for a service!!! No???

roadrunner
April 2nd, 2015, 06:14 AM
We all need this next :)

http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=22096&stc=1

The APR Turbo Delete System completely transforms the EA888 Gen 3 2.0T and takes performance to a whole new level of naturally aspirated perfection. Gone are the days of turbo lag as response is literally instant! Upon smashing the go pedal, expect an instant application of torque without the necessity of spinning the turbo over 150,000 RPM.

Fab_R
April 2nd, 2015, 06:38 AM
We all need this next :)

http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=22096&stc=1

The APR Turbo Delete System completely transforms the EA888 Gen 3 2.0T and takes performance to a whole new level of naturally aspirated perfection. Gone are the days of turbo lag as response is literally instant! Upon smashing the go pedal, expect an instant application of torque without the necessity of spinning the turbo over 150,000 RPM.

awesome mod this one.....take my money!!!!!!

gbernard
April 2nd, 2015, 06:49 AM
new to turbo cars, so pardon my ignorance, but what is a Turbo delete ?

sstorra
April 2nd, 2015, 06:52 AM
An April Fools joke...

omarko
April 2nd, 2015, 07:24 AM
so can someone please summarize this for me ?

1. Do I order directly through APR website ? - APR - High Performance Development for Audi, VW and Porsche Vehicles. (http://goapr.com.au/products/ecu_upgrade_s38v_20t_gen3_au.html)
2. What exactly happens when I order the tune ? Do I receive the box with instruction manual ?
3. If I understand it correctly, the box will re-flash my ECU with new tune. Is that correct?
4. What do I do with the box ? Or does it stay connected?
5. What happens when I take it to the dealer for service ? Do I flash back to stock / original tune?
6. Can dealer detect that this has been done thus I lose the warranty on relevant engine parts?

thanks in advance!

Doff
April 2nd, 2015, 08:17 AM
so can someone please summarize this for me ?

1. Do I order directly through APR website ? - APR - High Performance Development for Audi, VW and Porsche Vehicles. (http://goapr.com.au/products/ecu_upgrade_s38v_20t_gen3_au.html)
2. What exactly happens when I order the tune ? Do I receive the box with instruction manual ?
3. If I understand it correctly, the box will re-flash my ECU with new tune. Is that correct?
4. What do I do with the box ? Or does it stay connected?
5. What happens when I take it to the dealer for service ? Do I flash back to stock / original tune?
6. Can dealer detect that this has been done thus I lose the warranty on relevant engine parts?

thanks in advance!

1. you order through a reseller, they are listed on their website
2. you go to the shop, they instal it in less than a hour
3. Your ecu will be flashed with a new tune
4. there is no box, APR reseller flashes and then you drive away
5. Apr can flash to stock, most people seem to go to other workshops as to not go through the hassle of un-flashing.
6. Apparently not, look up TD1. this also discussed in this thread

sstorra
April 2nd, 2015, 08:19 AM
Roadrunner described the process in post #52 of this thread.

omarko
April 2nd, 2015, 10:13 AM
1. you order through a reseller, they are listed on their website
2. you go to the shop, they instal it in less than a hour
3. Your ecu will be flashed with a new tune
4. there is no box, APR reseller flashes and then you drive away
5. Apr can flash to stock, most people seem to go to other workshops as to not go through the hassle of un-flashing.
6. Apparently not, look up TD1. this also discussed in this thread

thank you very much, very helpful !

whats the average cost of installation ?

re: going to other workshops, I have free corporate servicing for 3 years so want to take advantage of that but if dealer cant detect it, no issue then !

Doff
April 2nd, 2015, 11:22 AM
Cost is on their website (1695), but its standardised - they sometimes have sales APR - High Performance Development for Audi, VW and Porsche Vehicles. (http://goapr.com.au/products/ecu_upgrade_s38v_20t_gen3_au.html)

If you are getting the servicing done at the dealer you would want to put it to stock for the service.

gbernard
April 2nd, 2015, 11:31 AM
An April Fools joke...

oops :oops: how embarrasment on me. . . .

Bain
April 2nd, 2015, 01:56 PM
1. you order through a reseller, they are listed on their website
2. you go to the shop, they instal it in less than a hour
3. Your ecu will be flashed with a new tune
4. there is no box, APR reseller flashes and then you drive away
5. Apr can flash to stock, most people seem to go to other workshops as to not go through the hassle of un-flashing.
6. Apparently not, look up TD1. this also discussed in this thread

In regards to 6. they can if the revisions are different.

When you get a service from Audi, the ECU revision increments by 1 when connected back to Audi Germany. You just have to make sure your mod vendor is pulling the latest ECU firmware from your ECU before reapplying the modded ecu flash.

P.S - If youre ******* around with the ECU then you shouldnt be complaining about possibly losing your warranty. You should lose your warranty.

Timbo
April 2nd, 2015, 06:13 PM
P.S - If youre ******* around with the ECU then you shouldnt be complaining about possibly losing your warranty. You should lose your warranty.

To be precise, you should lose your warranty with respect ONLY to any subsequent component failure that can be proven to have occurred as the direct consequence of you ******* around with the ECU. That is actually what the courts have said. [emoji4]

recruit2
April 2nd, 2015, 07:18 PM
In reality, if a turbo is going to let go for example, then it was doomed in the first place.

With 3 years of having my APR Stage 1 Golf R, no issues whatsoever.

I really can't see what's going to happen as a result of installing a Stage 1 tune.

Let's clear the air of all this doom/gloom and fear of the unknown!!!

*MOST* of the blown turbos I'm hearing about seemed to happen VERY QUICKLY after purchase with VERY low kms.
And if/when those ones blow, it's not APRs fault. Remove the tune and go make Audi fix their $70,000 piece of dodgy hardware.

recruit2
April 2nd, 2015, 07:27 PM
In other news, I gave it a few little squirts today on the way home and the car feels amazing.

Because my car was a demo, it had a few kms on it already when I got it. So fingers crossed a few test drivers hammered it a few times and already tested the limits of the turbo!

It feels rock solid and boosts hard.

roadrunner
April 3rd, 2015, 06:36 AM
In regards to 6. they can if the revisions are different.

When you get a service from Audi, the ECU revision increments by 1 when connected back to Audi Germany. You just have to make sure your mod vendor is pulling the latest ECU firmware from your ECU before reapplying the modded ecu flash.

P.S - If youre ******* around with the ECU then you shouldnt be complaining about possibly losing your warranty. You should lose your warranty.

This in not correct. APR keep your original OE file on their servers for you VIN. If you take you car into Audi with the APR tune they will detect it and will flag a TD1, So before ab Audi service, go back to APR and reload your VIN specific car's OE software, Audi will not be any the wiser.

The best option is just to get your car serviced at a good Euro independent garage, which is what I do. They will most likely do a better service than Audi anyhow.

recruit2
April 3rd, 2015, 09:29 AM
The best option is just to get your car serviced at a good Euro independent garage, which is what I do. They will most likely do a better service than Audi anyhow.

I fully agree with this and am doing the same... Not a fan of the huge dealerships.

11013mb
April 3rd, 2015, 06:45 PM
This in not correct. APR keep your original OE file on their servers for you VIN. If you take you car into Audi with the APR tune they will detect it and will flag a TD1, So before ab Audi service, go back to APR and reload your VIN specific car's OE software, Audi will not be any the wiser.

The best option is just to get your car serviced at a good Euro independent garage, which is what I do. They will most likely do a better service than Audi anyhow.

Hey RoadRunner

So when you request your original tune back for service / warranty purposes and for bisiting the Audi dealer - afterwards - I assume they can flash your stage 1 tune back without any issues since you are covered for updates to the tume in its own right ?


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roadrunner
April 4th, 2015, 07:03 AM
Hey RoadRunner

So when you request your original tune back for service / warranty purposes and for bisiting the Audi dealer - afterwards - I assume they can flash your stage 1 tune back without any issues since you are covered for updates to the tume in its own right ?


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APR dealer would always read the OE file first and reads the flash counter before installing, If at the Audi dealership you received a software update, this would be included.

noone
April 4th, 2015, 12:46 PM
For many years there has been discussion around warranty and detectability for tunes on VW / Audi's. The more advanced the ECU, the harder to crack the code and tune.
I expect that a dealer will be able to see if a car has been flashed or flashed back to stock (happy to be told otherwise) as there are elements of the program that tuners cant access / override / reset. Again, I'm not an expert, but in 5 years of VAG forum reading, wouldn't be surprised either way.

If your car has a mechanical fault and the dealership suspects or knows, they may decide to give you a bill rather than fix it, even if there is a known issue with that part (eg the turbo). You may be able to get legal involvement at this point, but then its lawyers against lawyers, no one is going to come away cheaply or quickly.

IMO, if you have the coin to play and take the risk, enjoy. The turbo fault issue sounds pretty minor (I've not read up on it, but it does not sound like impeller blades smashing through the housing) and could be a good opportunity to pick up a used turbo from someone going stage 3 or try a hybrid.

APR have extensive experience in the market and Guy is very helpful and approachable, APR is not my brand of choice (not discussing the 8V here) but for people new to Audi / VW and tuning, is a measured and fairly safe bet. This does not mean nothing can go wrong (these are precision machines from the factory, the software is detuned from the hardware's potential) and anyone considering should understand they take on some risk in the purchase.

Any turbo VW / Audi that is tuned should have a considerable improvement in torque and driver enjoyment, this was evident in my old 1.8T and now the 2.0T TFSI.

I will be interested to see the stage 2 options for the S3, the APR US site is showing close to 240 kw atw and 480nm @ 3300 rpm atw for a tune only, thats some serious power for just software upgrades to a good engine.

If there is a little more to be had with a better breathing intake and exhaust with more fuelling (if required), it will be interesting to see what follows with Stage 2.

Enjoy, I'm jelly of the new S3 sedan, but happy that my 2007 S3 won't be too far behind (for now).

CanberraS3
April 4th, 2015, 03:06 PM
For many years there has been discussion around warranty and detectability for tunes on VW / Audi's. The more advanced the ECU, the harder to crack the code and tune.
I expect that a dealer will be able to see if a car has been flashed or flashed back to stock (happy to be told otherwise) as there are elements of the program that tuners cant access / override / reset. Again, I'm not an expert, but in 5 years of VAG forum reading, wouldn't be surprised either way.

If your car has a mechanical fault and the dealership suspects or knows, they may decide to give you a bill rather than fix it, even if there is a known issue with that part (eg the turbo). You may be able to get legal involvement at this point, but then its lawyers against lawyers, no one is going to come away cheaply or quickly.

IMO, if you have the coin to play and take the risk, enjoy. The turbo fault issue sounds pretty minor (I've not read up on it, but it does not sound like impeller blades smashing through the housing) and could be a good opportunity to pick up a used turbo from someone going stage 3 or try a hybrid.

APR have extensive experience in the market and Guy is very helpful and approachable, APR is not my brand of choice (not discussing the 8V here) but for people new to Audi / VW and tuning, is a measured and fairly safe bet. This does not mean nothing can go wrong (these are precision machines from the factory, the software is detuned from the hardware's potential) and anyone considering should understand they take on some risk in the purchase.

Any turbo VW / Audi that is tuned should have a considerable improvement in torque and driver enjoyment, this was evident in my old 1.8T and now the 2.0T TFSI.

I will be interested to see the stage 2 options for the S3, the APR US site is showing close to 240 kw atw and 480nm @ 3300 rpm atw for a tune only, thats some serious power for just software upgrades to a good engine.

If there is a little more to be had with a better breathing intake and exhaust with more fuelling (if required), it will be interesting to see what follows with Stage 2.

Enjoy, I'm jelly of the new S3 sedan, but happy that my 2007 S3 won't be too far behind (for now).

My 2 cents worth...if people are worried about warranty and blowing turbos then don't get the tune, leave it stock and as boring as driving Miss Daisy.

The s3 is a completley different beast with the tune and you won't regret it!

recruit2
April 4th, 2015, 03:09 PM
Yep exactly and agree. It has totally transformed the car for me.


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CanberraS3
April 4th, 2015, 03:12 PM
In reality, if a turbo is going to let go for example, then it was doomed in the first place.

With 3 years of having my APR Stage 1 Golf R, no issues whatsoever.

I really can't see what's going to happen as a result of installing a Stage 1 tune.

Let's clear the air of all this doom/gloom and fear of the unknown!!!

*MOST* of the blown turbos I'm hearing about seemed to happen VERY QUICKLY after purchase with VERY low kms.
And if/when those ones blow, it's not APRs fault. Remove the tune and go make Audi fix their $70,000 piece of dodgy hardware.

I'll tell you what will happen, it will go from a boring drive (the cars biggest criticism) into a ball tearing beast that you can't keep the grin of your face a pedal off the floor :)

A.U.D.I.
April 4th, 2015, 03:37 PM
I'll tell you what will happen, it will go from a boring drive (the cars biggest criticism) into a ball tearing beast that you can't keep the grin of your face a pedal off the floor :)

Haha...can vouch for the performance difference. My stock S3 is a ripper when I compare it to my previous Mk6 GTI, but I got thoroughly burned by Remarcabul and CanberraS3 when they took off...

mobs
April 4th, 2015, 08:03 PM
Time for a sydney meetup so someone can convince me to risk my first gen turbo with a tune :_b:

Jussi70
April 4th, 2015, 08:58 PM
Haha...can vouch for the performance difference. My stock S3 is a ripper when I compare it to my previous Mk6 GTI, but I got thoroughly burned by Remarcabul and CanberraS3 when they took off...

It would nice to hear what kind on differencies have APR and ABT 400 hp tunes in driving pleasure. I mean that when driving both cars can you feel which one is APR and which one is ABT?

11013mb
April 4th, 2015, 11:10 PM
Time for a sydney meetup so someone can convince me to risk my first gen turbo with a tune :_b:

I agree . Roadrunner when are you free ?


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crc
April 5th, 2015, 11:09 AM
Time for a sydney meetup so someone can convince me to risk my first gen turbo with a tune :_b:

I would be keen for a Sydney meet up, didn't a forum member own a coffee shop somewhere?

noone
April 5th, 2015, 11:16 AM
Time for a sydney meetup so someone can convince me to risk my first gen turbo with a tune

Smart man, try on someone elses car before you buy...

omarko
April 5th, 2015, 11:23 AM
I think I need this mod , I just got smashed by what appeared to be a modified STI in a straight line off take :(

mobs
April 5th, 2015, 12:22 PM
Smart man, try on someone elses car before you buy...

I'm just sure once someone takes me for a spin and I feel the difference there will be no more excuses :)

11013mb
April 5th, 2015, 01:16 PM
I think I need this mod , I just got smashed by what appeared to be a modified STI in a straight line off take :(

Must have been modified as I was able to take a stock '15 model STi quite easily and this was before pedalbox


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mp2811
April 5th, 2015, 01:33 PM
You know you have serious power when the ESC kicks in on rapid take off! That was just going over 5000rpm and dry roads! Next time turn it off! Haven't used launch control as don't want to put the added stress on transmission, I'm sure that would take things to yet another level!

recruit2
April 5th, 2015, 04:37 PM
I'm just sure once someone takes me for a spin and I feel the difference there will be no more excuses :)

It's better than I expected it would be. It's seriously feels like 100hp has been added to the car, totally transformed the feel.

Now I couldn't imagine going back to lame stock power... Felt very linear/boring in comparison, it's brutal now.

I will stop here though now. For my daily driver, Stage 1 APR is PLENTY. I won't mess with the hardware i.e. exhausts and intake, and any more power and I'll start to wonder about the DSG and/or clutches flogging out over time. I'm not keen on upgrading my clutches, gearbox software blah blah and then you go down the infinite loop of car modding. So happy with my stock plus APR Stage 1. It has to be the best bang for your buck ever without modding the crap out of the car.

A.U.D.I.
April 5th, 2015, 05:54 PM
It's better than I expected it would be...I couldn't imagine going back to lame stock power... Felt very linear/boring in comparison, it's brutal now.
210kw = lame stock :shock:

tell me your bringing your brutal daily driver to the Canberra coffee catchup.... :)

noone
April 5th, 2015, 06:25 PM
I will stop here though now. For my daily driver, Stage 1 APR is PLENTY.

Joke Right?

I've said that before and now both times have gone much further. If its not outright power, its a supplementing mod, or lowering, or one of the dozens of other small mods that exist or will do soon.

recruit2
April 5th, 2015, 06:33 PM
210kw = lame stock :shock:

tell me your bringing your brutal daily driver to the Canberra coffee catchup.... :)

Done! Definitely... :)

sstorra
April 5th, 2015, 08:32 PM
It seriously feels like 100hp has been added to the car

Funny about that! :D

recruit2
April 5th, 2015, 08:49 PM
Did a run up to Sydney and back too, no issues, drove like a dream...

mp2811
April 6th, 2015, 10:16 AM
http://www.ozaudi.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=22152&stc=1
Here is custom dyno by Rick at Unicorm in UK (one of best tuners over there) He's consisently getting between 355-380 hp but more impressive is the 550nm of torque. another run of this car was 366 hp. Just for comparison.

Timbo
April 6th, 2015, 02:53 PM
Interesting! The only issue I have with UK dyno tests is that everything gets converted back to "engine horsepower" with many assumptions; as we all know, there's already enough manipulation happening on dynos without adding that conversation factor into the mix.

domino_z
April 6th, 2015, 03:26 PM
Gotta get this done, need the go to match the sound

just ticked over 1k km and heading out again now to rack up some more kays on the glass turbo

will go see dean during the week

Remarcabull
April 7th, 2015, 09:39 AM
Gotta get this done, need the go to match the sound

just ticked over 1k km and heading out again now to rack up some more kays on the glass turbo

will go see dean during the week


Im waiting to see their stage 2, if its decently above stage 1 i might just jump to that and be done with it. Of course i will replace my turbo to the 722 H first , enquring now on time and labor costs to replace. :)

roadrunner
April 7th, 2015, 09:51 AM
Im waiting to see their stage 2, if its decently above stage 1 i might just jump to that and be done with it. Of course i will replace my turbo to the 722 H first , enquring now on time and labor costs to replace. :)

Fairly sure that the APR upgrade from an S1 to S2 is only the $ difference. I.e. if the S1 is $1700 and the S2 is $3000, then you pay $1300 to upgrade.

Why replace a turbo that is probably fine? Everyone is stressing too much about these turbos which probably affect 1 in 250 cars. The labour cost to replace the turbo will be big and it 722H may still fail. Will Audi still cover you by warranty if a 722H is fitted and it blows?

Remarcabull
April 7th, 2015, 11:35 AM
Fairly sure that the APR upgrade from an S1 to S2 is only the $ difference. I.e. if the S1 is $1700 and the S2 is $3000, then you pay $1300 to upgrade.

Why replace a turbo that is probably fine? Everyone is stressing too much about these turbos which probably affect 1 in 250 cars. The labour cost to replace the turbo will be big and it 722H may still fail. Will Audi still cover you by warranty if a 722H is fitted and it blows?


I think its 4-5 hours labour,i believe its not hard to change. Audi wont cover it as im buying the turbo elsewhere, i can buy 3 turbos for the cost of sourcing it from Audi.

I would really like to know the statistics on 702N failing, but the issue i have is not with it blowing but if the crap goes into my engine :( which by the way is about $12000 to replace :)

mp2811
April 8th, 2015, 07:10 PM
I read apr stage 1 with intake got 12.08 1/4 at 110.8! Guessing our tune with bit more hp than USA should be good for 11 in right conditions! (That was mk7R)

asgardloki
April 8th, 2015, 09:34 PM
found this little table on GoAPR.com

http://www.goapr.com/includes/img/products/dyno/20_tsi_ea888_gen3_mqb_r/20_tsi_gen3_mqb_r_s0_vs_s1_93_acc.png

mp2811
April 8th, 2015, 10:07 PM
I've looked at that table and since our ROW tune tested at 3.9 0-100 then the extra 20hp good for maybe 0.1-0.15 faster. Hence why I think someone will hit 11sec 1/4 mile soon enough on stage 1 !

domino_z
April 9th, 2015, 12:59 PM
60-130 @13sec is cute

i do that in high 4s in my r35 lolz

Shane_S3
April 9th, 2015, 01:58 PM
High 4s ? Thats cute.. my bugatti does it in 3s.. on my ps4 of course [emoji6]

KAMBO
April 9th, 2015, 02:24 PM
tuned cars vs. stock bikes is cute!

Remarcabull
April 9th, 2015, 02:43 PM
tuned cars vs. stock bikes is cute!

pffft my RC Helicopter does 0-180km in less than 3 seconds... to which i need to turn around again :)

KAMBO
April 9th, 2015, 03:03 PM
pffft my RC Helicopter does 0-180km in less than 3 seconds... to which i need to turn around again :)

you're onboard? :)

Remarcabull
April 9th, 2015, 04:20 PM
you're onboard? :)

I dont know if i want to be... i like to fly inverted :) but a small dog could

recruit2
April 9th, 2015, 04:32 PM
I reckon that claimed 3.6secs 0-100 kmh is a bit optimistic but I reckon it has to be close to 4 seconds flat in real life...


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sammo
April 9th, 2015, 04:39 PM
I reckon that claimed 3.6secs 0-100 kmh is a bit optimistic but I reckon it has to be close to 4 seconds flat in real life...

I'd say just under 4.0s based on 3.8 for 0-60mph. See below.

First Drive- APR Stage 1 Volkswagen Golf R - VWVortex (http://www.vwvortex.com/features/reviews-and-road-tests/first-drive-apr-stage-1-golf-r)

Joecool
April 9th, 2015, 04:50 PM
it's still seriously quick, how ever you want to look at it!!

Aussie Audi Guy
April 9th, 2015, 05:13 PM
3.9 would be achievable

mp2811
April 9th, 2015, 05:14 PM
I'd say just under 4.0s based on 3.8 for 0-60mph. See below.

First Drive- APR Stage 1 Volkswagen Golf R - VWVortex (http://www.vwvortex.com/features/reviews-and-road-tests/first-drive-apr-stage-1-golf-r)

I'd guess you need DSG tune to get lower than 3.8 0-100. would need the higher launch control etc. then prob get under 3.7

recruit2
April 9th, 2015, 05:21 PM
Yeah I'd definitely believe it could be under 4, it certainly feels like it. But 3.6 is like FAAAAAST. 3.8-3.9 I'd believe though no question.

Yes that's brilliant!!!


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recruit2
April 9th, 2015, 05:22 PM
Has anyone dragged a stock A45 against a stage 1 8V S3?? The S3 would have to win???


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domino_z
April 9th, 2015, 05:36 PM
tuned cars vs. stock bikes is cute!

litre bikes are good fun from a roll......if they can get the front wheel down

domino_z
April 9th, 2015, 05:38 PM
Has anyone dragged a stock A45 against a stage 1 8V S3?? The S3 would have to win???


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stage 1 S3 would be quicker

stock A/CLA45 is a mid-high 12s car stock

tuned S3 would be in the low 12s, maybe even crack an 11 if all the stars align

recruit2
April 9th, 2015, 07:12 PM
The 8V S3 + Stage 1 is a weapon for the out lay. Golf R even more so per $


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xssiiv
April 9th, 2015, 09:12 PM
Looking into this next week, looks like those that have it are very impressed!

Remarcabull
April 10th, 2015, 10:14 AM
Has anyone dragged a stock A45 against a stage 1 8V S3?? The S3 would have to win???


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I did when mine was stock, and they are pretty damn close together, with stage one u would walk away from it no issues at all haha.

recruit2
April 10th, 2015, 12:55 PM
I did when mine was stock, and they are pretty damn close together, with stage one u would walk away from it no issues at all haha.

Yeah OK cool - thought so...

CanberraS3
April 10th, 2015, 01:30 PM
Sadly I'm finding most cars aren't interested in a little squirt from the lights. Every man and his dog seems to drive a Clubsport, Maloo or SS in Canberra and in my previous GS ute it was always on for young an old.....Not that I ever dragged people, the clutch just seemed to slip rather frequently at the lights.